lego dude here :D

[legodude]

Hi guys!

I've been searching for old games recently and RR was among them, I was surprised to find a modding website for it (especially an active one). I'll try to contribute where I can.

Been modding Call of Duty games for 6 years now, I'm skilled with Photoshop, 3D Studio Max (modelling, UV unwrapping, baking normal/ambient oc maps etc), Sony Vegas, UDK engine, ID tech engine etc. Also worked with the CryEngine 2, CoH and a lot of older games (currently learning C++ OpenGL, experienced with C-style game scripting), I'm currently working for a small studio a friend and I founded working with the UDK engine.

Anyway nice site and mods, I'm currently making high-resolution tileable world textures for the game without actually modifying the gameplay but simply increasing the quality.

Would be nice if I knew how to make some nice high poly models and rig them for this game, but it's 11 years old and I have no idea how that would be done. :P

[Cirevam]

Willkommen legodude! It's good to see that you have plenty of modding skills.

As for high-poly models, we're actually in the process of getting custom models to display their textures correctly in-game, since any we've tried appear as either white or superblack, but if you can find a solution that would be great.

[Addictgamer]

Hey there LegoDude.

According to my username, I'm addictgamer.

Just know me as the guy who works on ORR, bakes cookies, and has the craziest scientific theories.

As long as you don't spam or flame, you're safe

What do you and your friend do in that game studio? If you don't mind me asking.

How would you rate yourself in C++?

We could always use another member on the ORR team.

If you are curious on what ORR is, then go here.

Although that topic doesn't really give the best info on ORR...

[RockmoddeR]

Welcome! just wait till you see the new high poly rock raider...

[legodude]

Willkommen legodude! It's good to see that you have plenty of modding skills.

As for high-poly models, we're actually in the process of getting custom models to display their textures correctly in-game, since any we've tried appear as either white or superblack, but if you can find a solution that would be great.

If the model shows up white that might mean you're using the wrong bitmap settings, it has to be 8-bit 256 colors.

Models showed up black in Call of Duty if you didn't give the model a white base color in the 3D program, try applying a white color to the in your modelling program (I think this makes the vertices white) - in Maya you can do that by going in "Polygons" mode then go to “Color → Apply Color Options (click on the box)"

As for my C++ skills I'm still a beginner learning the language then moving on to OpenGL, for the past 6-8 years I've done art work only (modelling, texturing, animation, effects etc.) but recently I've gained an interest in C++ (my friend is the programmer and is now doing more art work)

In other words I'm in no position yet to start work on game engines but hopefully I will be ready within the year.

[RockmoddeR]

O_O so THAT's why...

You've already contributed a valuable piece of information...

[Addictgamer]

As for my C++ skills I'm still a beginner learning the language then moving on to OpenGL, for the past 6-8 years I've done art work only (modelling, texturing, animation, effects etc.) but recently I've gained an interest in C++ (my friend is the programmer and is now doing more art work)

In other words I'm in no position yet to start work on game engines but hopefully I will be ready within the year.

Ah, ok.

In about a year, we should be starting all the opengl stuff for the 3D version, if I advance in programming, that is.

I am not the best with graphics...Although I can do some 3D modelling...

Does your friend happen to have an interest in RR?

[legodude]

Hes on a university and very busy with the studio I also doubt hes ever played the game, I spend most of my day working with games so if you need help with 3D modelling / unwrapping / texturing that should be no problem for me, I'd love to see a re-make of this game where you have full controll over the game engine.

Learning C++ and OpenGL shouldn't take too long, I'm experienced in C-style scripting and I have written singleplayer missions and AI for Call of Duty mods.

[Cirevam]

If the model shows up white that might mean you're using the wrong bitmap settings, it has to be 8-bit 256 colors.

Models showed up black in Call of Duty if you didn't give the model a white base color in the 3D program, try applying a white color to the in your modelling program (I think this makes the vertices white) - in Maya you can do that by going in "Polygons" mode then go to “Color → Apply Color Options (click on the box)"

Too bad I've already been using 256 color BMP images since LRR crashes if you use anything else, and I'm not sure if Maya can export models as LWO 5.x. If it can then I'll have to grab the trial from one of the computers at home this weekend, but from what we've tried so far Lightwave and Milkshape both make textured models superblack. If I don't put textures on them they become white. We think the problem is with which directories the models are looking in to find their textures, since every model in LRR looks in the Mother or Z directories for files which we suspect are within the WAD itself.

I've already made a topic on what I know about LWO files, and I've posted some pictures of what the ones I export look like in-game. Check those out and see if anything rings a bell, but I've already tried modern methods of getting these things to work and failed. If you need/want links I will deliver.

so THAT's why...

Which THAT are you referring to? Everyone on the forum who's been here since the reskin competition knows I've been using 256 color bitmaps, and since Lightwave 5.x strips all specular and diffuse data off the models applying a primer won't make the color stick. I know the latter is true since I open the models in Lightwave after I export them to check if they're corrupt. So in both cases, that's NOT why, unless Maya does something magical that makes textures look right on LWO files. I really doubt it though, since Lightwave itself makes 5.x models superblack, but not 6.5-7.0 models.

[legodude]

I also highly doubt 3ds Max or Maya is capable of exporting it to such an old filetype, it needs a plugin which is usually provided for modders but not in this case obviously.

Also, the models you are creating, do they have their own information in the cfg like where the texture is located etc.? Try to replace the original files with your new files using the exact same names etc. (I assume you've done this but I'm just making sure)

Now that I see it though it appears they use multiple textures on one model instead of one unwrapped texture, this is definately a problem and the game might have problems locating the correct files.

[Cirevam]

Also, the models you are creating, do they have their own information in the cfg like where the texture is located etc.? Try to replace the original files with your new files using the exact same names etc. (I assume you've done this but I'm just making sure)

Now that I see it though it appears they use multiple textures on one model instead of one unwrapped texture, this is definately a problem and the game might have problems locating the correct files.

1) The texture locations are stored within the LWO files themselves; you can open them with Notepad/PSPad and see for yourself. However, I did look over the CFG just to make sure there wasn't some obvious thing we missed, and I didn't see anything there.

2) You bet it's a problem, and here's something related. Every time I open an LWO or LWS file I have to spend a few minutes finding most of the textures for the models because Lightwave is searching in the Mother directories, as that's where the LWOs are telling it to look. Actually, I have to do this for ANY LWO file I export, no matter what and where the textures are. It gets really bad when it I have to keep switching between the shared folders and the object-specific folders. Milkshape has no problem finding textures from stuff I make, but it still tries to look in the Mother directories for textures, so when I import something all the faces just have their lighting values and blank textures.

[legodude]

Looking at the LWO files they do indeed contain the texture information, the problem is I think the developers used some sort of an asset manager program, Call of Duty had one of these to generate files like this (material files) which hold the data that tells the game where everything is stored.

If this is the case then it will be nearly impossible to use custom models unless your model has the exact same amount of lose parts and lose textures so that you can replace the original ones without messing up the file but how in gods name you do that is beyond me.

Also, do you know how to export models to the .lws filetype?

[TheDoctor]

AND IM...

Hi.

Cirevam here has made the most progress with .LWS files out of everyone here (combined). Just check his gallery for his achievements. Probably because he HAS Lightwave. Anyways, hi again.

[Cirevam]

If this is the case then it will be nearly impossible to use custom models unless your model has the exact same amount of lose parts and lose textures so that you can replace the original ones without messing up the file but how in gods name you do that is beyond me.

Also, do you know how to export models to the .lws filetype?

1) Lose parts and lose textures? I don't follow.

2) LWS files are actually animations. I've found that I can export LWS files perfectly, though getting the CFG and AE files to sync up is a little tricky. LWO files are the models, and there are some plugins for various modeling programs that will let you export them. Milkshape comes with a decent one. Oh, and the custom models are usable, it's just that we're restricted to either white or black for the colors for now.

[legodude]

If you can turn the model into a filetype I can open in Maya/Max then I might be able to get it to work without the models showing up black.

[TheDoctor]

If you can turn the model into a filetype I can open in Maya/Max then I might be able to get it to work without the models showing up black.

I TOLD YOU CIREVAM!!! You DO have competition.

[Zephyria]

Hello,

I'm Dragon

Wow, You are like....Awesome, With all that 3D Modeling and Shiznitz

[Cirevam]

I TOLD YOU CIREVAM!!! You DO have competition.

More like a colleague. I can export my stuff in OBJ format. Will that work, or is there a preferred filetype?

[Lair]

Looking at the LWO files they do indeed contain the texture information, the problem is I think the developers used some sort of an asset manager program, Call of Duty had one of these to generate files like this (material files) which hold the data that tells the game where everything is stored.

If this is the case then it will be nearly impossible to use custom models unless your model has the exact same amount of lose parts and lose textures so that you can replace the original ones without messing up the file but how in gods name you do that is beyond me.

An obvious statement: It was somehow done by the game creators. And I don't think it is anywhere in the exe, and since being hardcoded into the exe is the only way those odd directories would be impossible to mod, there must be SOMETHING that can set it to have that type of extension.

Anyways, welcome to RRU. I find it interesting that most people come to RRU because they were looking through their games one day and stumbled upon Rock Raiders, fall in love with it again and look for ways to improve. It ALSO shows how EPIC LRR is, as it seems to always be the thing that they stop at and play and come here.

[Aki Dazrold]

Hi, I'm-

*Head explodes*

Geez, all this discussion in a new members topic. Mofo. Wait, how am I still talking with no face? *die*

[legodude]

I TOLD YOU CIREVAM!!! You DO have competition.

More like a colleague. I can export my stuff in OBJ format. Will that work, or is there a preferred filetype?

Yes .obj files are great

Some questions though:

1. if I make a completely new high poly model, unwrap the UV's then make a texture for it - can you or can you not import it to RR and rig it so that regular anims work on it? (ignore the blackness for now)

2. could you find out what parts of the models have animation, so I can keep an eye on those when modelling.

[Cirevam]

The relationship between LWO models and LWS animations is completely backwards from how models and animations work today. Oddly enough, the the LWO files are merely pieces that get arranged by the LWS files, and the LWS files determine the final shape of the model. This is why you can remodel pieces of an existing vehicle or creature and not have the animations get screwed up. So to answer your question, yes I can "rig" anything you throw at me, and you don't need to worry about messing up the animation. The only problem is that the origin of the models are retained in the LWS files, and some models are offset, so if you put the center of mass at the origin it may not look right unless I reposition it.

Oh, and I'll get you the files sometime this weekend. Got a bunch of exams to finish before I go home.

[legodude]

Sounds great, can't wait to see some new models in the game.

I'm thinking of re-modelling a large vehicle first, if you could provide me with the .obj file of the original vehicle then i can re-model it so that it has correct scaling to prevent any problems with animation like you mentioned above (if the vehicle consists of multiple .obj files thats no problem). Do we know of any polygon limit in the game engine? Will a high resolution texture (1024x1024) wrap properly on this old engine? (so far only tested 512x512 and 256x256 textures, due to the low resolution I recommend using 256x256 though because any higher and the detail will be lost because of the low resolution).

But I could just make a 1024x1024 texture and test smaller sizes, they will still wrap properly around the model you just gotta make sure the ratio stays the same.

Here's some models I've been doing for other project, a subdivided ultra-high poly model of a tank which contains no detail yet (used to generate normal maps for low poly game-ready models) and some random box thingy to test a normal mapping method.

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7366/tigerds.jpg

Here is the final game-ready box with my texture:

[Addictgamer]

Awesome work legodude.